You can spend a pleasant hour listening to none other than Bob Thiel, Th.D, being interviewed by "Billy the Brain," on KKZZ just this week. But be quick, the show is only available for a few more days.
"Billy the Brain" was generous to Dr Bob ("you have done your homework, sir"), listing his many splendid academic accomplishments (did you know Bob has written seven books?) before launching out into the topic of 2012. Strangely enough, there was no mention of the disputed Th.D. Hmm. That didn't stop Billy from touting his guest as an "absolute expert": obviously he's easily impressed. Maybe I'm just a cynic, but having had to wing it through a few situations myself from time to time, I got the distinct impression that "the Brain" had only just picked up the book and skimmed the chapter heads before going on air, and thought Bob was there to "debunk" the movie that is coming out next week.
Credit where credit is due though, COGdom's favorite naturopath came across reasonably well, and he didn't get sidetracked into Sabbaths and other red-herring issues, but stayed focused throughout. Not even a free plug for the Living Church of God or Tomorrow's World.
And how many callers did Bob attract? Well, zilch, zip, nada. Sad. It's doubtful that Bob will make his fortune selling this thing, and even if he did, well, there wouldn't really be time to spend it anyway would there?
Oh, and yes, while Bob won't commit to 2012, he nonetheless assured Billy that the End is scheduled for the next decade. When LCG collapses, could it be that Bob cuts free and establishes himself as the Willie Dankenbring for a new generation?
I have sold one copy of "2013-Prophecy Through Goat Entrails and Why It Matters" to my mom. That's about it so far. But I am expecting that to pick up as we get closer to the time.
So far GEPTWTPUAL (Goat Entrails Point the Way to Prophecy Unveiled At Last.") tells me...
The Universe had neither heard of the Pope nor Dave Pack
The New Ambassador Auditorium does not send the proper message to the brethern of "Jesus is coming soon" very well.
The Egret Sculpture, now in the hands of Gerald Flurry, will not animate and fly away to her place and that Egrets are not Eagles.
All the leaders of the COG's will get older before they get younger.
All the leaders of the COG's will die once in their life and then the funeral.
Gavin Rumney will get a real degree in theology and all of those on AW will join his church of which he will be be the pastor.
This COG (Church of Gavin) will be hugely successful and carved in stone over the lintel will be the words "I Earned Mine--Earn Yours Too."
Ron Weinland and His Wife will be dethroned as the Two Witnesses as Dave Pack declare himself in a four hour sermon to be both.
Dave Pack will declare Gerald Flurry an heretic while Gerald declares his son the Messiah. The Son will smite the Angel of the Church of Laodicea, i.e. Joshua, and recloth him with dirty garments but include a coupon for 50% off at the Philidelphia Dry Cleaners.
Bill Dankenbring will utter.."But I'm the Apostle..pick me, pick me."
Evolution in all the COG's will be easily dismissed by the new truth that "I didn't come from no monkey." This will put the churches clearly back on track and make perfect scense to all the scientifically apostate in the Churches.
The final blow to evolution will come when the ministry declares "If I came from a chimp, why are there still chimps around today." Praise Jesus! Truth conquers those stuck in science falsely so called.
Dr Thiel will admit his TH.D was not from the Yale Divinity School.
Well...I can only get so much prophecy out of one dead goat. He is now guttless and will not have the guts to prophecy again.
Anyone have a goat for sale?
"When LCG collapses, could it be that Bob cuts free and establishes himself as the Willie Dankenbring for a new generation?"
Heresy! When Spanky does finally kick the bucket, there will be technology in place for the "faithful holding fast" to reanimate his corpse.
Prove me wrong.
OK, and what does this teach us - the fact that folks like Ron Weinland and Bob Thiel have to resort to being interviewed by disc jockeys because there are no other serious takers willing to waste their air time with such loons?
You too can listen to KKZZ AM 1400 by going to this link:
And don’t forget to catch the “Dr. Bunny Show” while you’re there!
I don't know about all this...a laymember writing a book about prophecy and the end of the world- and selling it to the public without ministerial approval...and now he's going on the airways? Who does he think he is?
Well, I listened to this interview.
What interests me is how interested the interviewer seemed to be in this bogus crap.
But I ask a simple question: of all the various "prophecies" (biblical and otherwise, like Mayan, African, Sunni Islam, Irish Catholic, etc.) that Thiel cites, how have they EVER actually improved the human condition?
Thiel makes it sound like many of these "prophecies" have come to pass as predicted, and yet the actual objective record shows something completely different. And ignorance among his readers and listeners allows him to get away with this!
This is complete deception.
"Gavin Rumney will get a real degree in theology and all of those on AW will join his church of which he will be be the pastor."
Can't speak for anyone else here, but I wouldn't join a church that would have me for a member! Sorry Gavin.
NostraThomas Quatrain 75
He that doctors with many degrees... both true and anti-true,
shall emerge from his endeavors with ova over his visage.
Tho he attempt to portray his scribings as learned,
many scoffers shall arise and question his honesty.
As mid-late night American TV guy Jay Leno asked recently, "If the Mayans could predict the future, then why didn't they see the Spaniards coming??
I try and try but, for the life of me, I can't even work up the capacity to care.
Nothing these people believe will alter reality even one bit. Just an empty hope on their death bed that the next thing they experience will be their own resurrection.
Tell me again my cynicism is more evil than false hope?
Baywolfe, cynicism is not evil, but your understanding of "reality" is inaccurate.
Everyone's understanding of reality (and that includes everyone who posts here) should be evolving because modern physics has shown us that the physical universe and the reality that we have always accepted is not valid.
Billy the Brain?!?!
Aw c'mon -- not even alleged know-it-alls Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck or Rachel Maddow give themselves titles like this.
The only self-proclaimed "Brain" to which I've paid attention in recent years is off the air now -- and had a partner named Pinky.
"I try and try but, for the life of me, I can't even work up the capacity to care."
Well, I've worked up the capacity to "4 TEH LULZ" but I've been reading too much Chanology lately.....
"....and the reality that we have always accepted is not valid."
You're trying to come across as open to the very nature of reality and our existence, but your real intent is trying to leave the back door open for your imaginary diety and the fairy tales of the Bible.
By the way, I'm working on two projects that I hope to publish in peer-reviewed journals soon. I was wondering, since you have a PhD in the biological sciences, where were you published? In many departments it is mandatory to publish your research before you can receive your doctorate.
The Apostate Paul
"...modern physics has shown us that the physical universe and the reality that we have always accepted is not valid."
Larry, you claim to have a PhD and be a scientist, so would you care to explain in greater detail as to what your exact meaning here is?
Though I’m not a physicist by profession nor academic background, still, I do have a fairly decent understanding of quantum physics, new theoretical developments in the field of astrophysics, etc.
And I find your assertion to be quite incomprehensible as stated. This is what I mean when I’ve accused you in the past of not communicating very clearly, and your above comment is a text book example of lack of precision and clarity. Not exactly what we’d expect from a practicing well-known scientist you claim to be, if you know what I mean.
A specific and intelligible explanation this time would be appreciated – rather than your usual fundamentalist ambiguities and evasions.
Or will you just arrogantly ignore this request as you normally do because you’re simply not able – in spite of your being a self-proclaimed “scientist” - to provide a considerably more clearer verbal expression than your above generality?
HOW does modern physics or recent findings in cosmology show us that the reality we’ve always accepted is no longer valid?
In what way would this be true - PARTS of reality, or ALL of it?
WHAT specific findings would you be referring to in order to support your assertion?
WHO says this is the case?
And WHY would this be so?
Paul, do you derive pleasure from insulting people?
The reality of the physical universe around us is not limited to the 4 dimensions within which we exist and can sense. My grasp of relativity, quantum mechanics and string theory is not what it used to be. (age does take its toll) But, there are at least 10 dimensions plus time (the 11th) and they exist and are real even if we are oblivious to them.
Do other beings exist in those dimensions who can perceive ours and travel through all? Like "your imaginary deity"?
The Bible suggests the answer is yes.
Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us.
2Kings 6: 16 "Don't be afraid," the prophet answered. "Those who are with us are more than those who are with them."
17 And Elisha prayed, "O LORD, open his eyes so he may see." Then the LORD opened the servant's eyes, and he looked and saw the hills full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha.
So, reality is not limited to what we can see, hear, feel and measure right now.
If you were really smart, you would stop criticizing those who argue for God's existence, because the truth is YOU don't know. You can argue your atheistic philosophy til the cows come home, but you have no more proof than those who disagree with you.
Larry said a while back:
"Sorry Russell, evolution is still VERY much debatable. As a scientist, I know a great deal about the intracacies of biochemistry. For evolution to be absolutely true, and without any divine guidance, requires an INCREDIBLE amount of serendipity."
I think this is the first mention by Larry of his occupation as a scientist. I've taken a look at the posts where I mention that I am a scientist, and as far as I can tell (I may be wrong), I did so address specific misconceptions- how science actually works, scientific research , ect. But Larry here (addressing evolution) seems to be mounting an argument from authority, doesn't he?
Well, that's fine. But if you are to put forth an argument from authority- shouldn't you be bound to prove your authority?
The Apostate Paul
"So, reality is not limited to what we can see, hear, feel and measure right now."
Based on your understanding of physics and religious scripture? That's very convincing, Larry.
But your imaginary diety is not confined to some alternative reality that we can't comprehend- according to the same religious scriptures, he walks and talks and eats and interact with people, on this earth, in physical form (But never in the last 2000 years). God can be seen and heard and felt and be measured. But he hasn't put in an appearance. Neither has Allah, or a leprechaun.
Does your extra avenues of reality have room for Allah? Leprechauns? Or does Jehovah walk those weird halls by himself?
"If you were really smart...."
I didn't say I was smart. But I am rational, and can think clearly.
"....you would stop criticizing those who argue for God's existence, because the truth is YOU don't know."
I "know" with the same certainty that I "know" that leprechauns and Allah are figments of the imagination- which is to say I'm pretty sure as far as disproving a negative goes. Do you think it wrong to criticize Muslims who argue for Allah's existence? Because YOU don't know that Allah doesn't exist, do you? Well?
"You can argue your atheistic philosophy til the cows come home, but you have no more proof than those who disagree with you."
Atheism isn't a philosophy, Professor. It's a lack of belief in god. That's all. It's very similar to your aleprechaunism. Your aunicornism. Avishnuism.
Professor, I'll try to dumb this down as much as possible. You can never disprove the existence of something that in all respects doesn't appear to exist.
Can you follow this? Are you with me? For example, people down through the ages have believed in fantastical creatures like leprechauns and vampires. But very few people believe that these creatures really exist. You don't, and neither do I. Why don't we? Because we, nor has anyone else, ever seen a vampire or a leprechaun as described in ancient folklore. The powers attributed to these creatures have never been evidenced.
Therefore, you and I both conclude, based on these observations, that neither vampires or leprechauns exist.
Can you grasp this concept? Good.
Now why is it so hard for you to understand that I take this same standard and apply it to your diety? For it is the same, Professor- there is no more evidence for the existence of your diety than there is for leprechauns. So why do you fault me for my view?
Unless you are willing to admit, based on your logic, that there very well may be vampires and leprechauns. But you aren't and that makes you a hypocrite in my book.
Again, Professor Weasel, what is your degree? Where did you receive it from? Have you published in peer-reviewed journals? Why won't you answer?
You aren't another Bob Thiel, are you?
The Apostate Paul
aka Paul Ray
BS Science 2004 ULM
Doctoral Candidate Molecular Toxicology NCSU
"If you were really smart, you would stop criticizing those who argue for God's existence, because the truth is YOU don't know."
So asking you to put up or shut up, and prove to us your "university degree" isn't as bogus as Bob Thiel's is "criticizing" you?
"You can argue your atheistic philosophy til the cows come home, but you have no more proof than those who disagree with you."
Sorry, Larry, but atheists don't NEED to argue at all with respect to the supernatural God question. The burden of proof is completely on the frail shoulders of the theists, you know, those actually making the claim.
Believers in an invisible supernatural Deity have made the affirmative assertion; therefore it’s up to THEM to provide the evidence, rationale and lines of reasoning to demonstrate their claims to the rest of us, not the atheists to disprove it.
Remember, we’ve gone over this many times before.
If you were actually the world-class biochemist you claim to be you would easily understand this “burden of proof” principle, because it’s very much a part of the scientific method. But it appears that the “world-class university” you got your science training at didn’t quite cover that material, at least in your case.
But since you are nothing more than a ranting "preach & run" supernatural fundamentalist trying to project a falsehood, this explains why you can't seem to mentally grasp this extremely elementarily concept.
Theists can’t provide any credible evidence or rationale, of course, anymore than I can offer proof of the literal existence of my invisible, rainbow-colored unicorn that talks to me at night before I go to bed. They’ve been trying now for many centuries, and have consistently failed. A high school boy with a fair understanding of religious claims and a reasonable science education can completely refute every argument for a supernatural god ever posed by the greatest religious minds in all of history.
Larry, permit me a heart-to-heart statement here: don’t you think it’s time to put an end to your foolish charade? We know you aren’t the well-educated PhD scientist with a doctorate from a “world class university” simply based on the total emptiness of your words and your virtually non-existent reasoning skills.
Many of my friends are PhD’s, and I’ve had lots of conversations with numerous people in my life with doctorates, and in general, they are quite articulate. You, on the other hand, obviously can’t reason your way out of a paper bag if your life depended on it. All you can do is appeal to your “proof scriptures,” and poorly-chosen ones at that, in order to try to establish your nutty assertions about physics and supernatural religion.
Can’t you see that you are not only making an utter fool out of yourself, but that you are discrediting the very supernatural worldview that you desperately are trying to persuade others of.
So why don’t you go back to your laboratory and do more research on the “intricacies of biochemistry”- because you quite clearly are getting nowhere here. It’s fairly easy to see beyond the cheap façade you’ve tried to construct in order to lend some kind of academic credence to your nonsensical assertions.
It is said that St. Augustine was asked the question: “What was God doing before He created the world?” to which he answered, “Preparing hell for those who asked unnecessary questions!” This was the man who also said, “There is another form of temptation, even more fraught with danger. This is the disease of curiosity…It is this which drives us to try and discover the secrets of nature, those secrets which are beyond our understanding, which can avail us nothing, and which man should not wish to learn.”
Larry, you seem much more comfortable with this line of thought than in the real-world field of scientific inquiry.
Oh, and by the way, we’re still awaiting your specific answers to the questions I posed to you in my last post.
Paul, congratulations on your academic achievement. That is always good. If it was tempered with a dose of humility, it would be even more impressive.
"Paul, congratulations on your academic achievement. That is always good. If it was tempered with a dose of humility, it would be even more impressive."
I don't want your congratulations.
I listed my degree and my current program and university not to boast, for if that was what I sought I would have done so a long time ago. I listed them to prove that I am being truthful and open, and hopefully as an example that you will do the same.
Humility? You know what real humility is? It's not making a pathetic argument from authority, yourself being the authority. That's arrogant. Others may think you have withheld your academic achievements out of modesty, but at this point, after you have been asked repeatedly (ten times?) to provide them, and refuse- I think it's clear that modesty or humility has little to do with it.
The Apostate Paul
Well, once again, in the great tradition of the many other fundamentalist bloggers who’ve come here to boldly witness for God and “refute the gainsayers” - yet who eventually just slink off the field of serious debate in defeat by refusing to face up to the rigorous questioning of their supernatural religious ideology, Larry follows suit by just ignoring such inquiries.
Just what we’d expect from a PhD scientist trained in the scientific method at a world class university - run away from reality in the hopes that it will eventually go away and not interfere with his loony religious beliefs, right?!
Lesson for the rest of us: the fundamentalist mindset is rooted in subjective fantasy, a denial of objective reality and an underlying yet obvious hatred of rationality and the methods of reason. And that’s WHY these folks consistently refuse to face up to the hard questions their many assertions invite, and will seek every possible avenue of evasion possible to avoid the responsibility to “always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks [them] a reason for the hope that is in [them]…” (I Pet 3:15)
Oh yes, they can offer up all kinds of flimsy excuses (such as Leonardo is a mean-spirited person, or that they are so busy in their scientific pursuits that they just don’t have the time to spare, etc.) – but it’s clear for all to see they have no answers that can withstand seriously scrutiny.
And I hope the many others who read this blogsite can learn this vital lesson. It’s not unique to this website at all, just go to any other site where these kinds of topics are discussed – there are many of them out there on the Internet - and you will see virtually the same identical pattern of COWARDLY RETREAT on the part of the True Believers, as so obviously evidenced by folks like Larry.
Larry wins the debate!!! Ya see... you don't need so called science and so called facts, when you have Jesus!! Glory!!! Can I get an amen?!!!
Science is the work of satan and Larry knows it, that is why he won't stoop to give his credentials to the servants of the devil.
How do I know God and Jesus exist? Because the bible says it is true. How do I know the bible is true? Because the bible says it is true! How do I know that Allah does not exist? Because the bible says that all other gods are false.
All you need is Jesus and the bible is his divinely inspired word! If you don't believe me, check it out in your bible. The bible is the proof of the bible, and faith is the proof of God. God says so in the bible. Could it get any more simple than that?
"Others may think you have withheld your academic achievements out of modesty, but at this point, after you have been asked repeatedly (ten times?) to provide them, and refuse- I think it's clear that modesty or humility has little to do with it."
Look at it from our perspective Larry: Even Tom Mahon eventually posted his picture here, as requested. It took a couple of years, but eventually he came around. We are hopeful that you will too.
Of course if your "university degree" is the retconned Ambassador College piece of paper that ex-members are allowed to claim, for the brief time Headquarters was "accredited" before Junior sold it, took the money, and made it disappear --- well I can see why you wouldn't want to admit to us that's where your "world-accredited university degree" came from.
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