Sunday, 26 November 2006
Ronnie warns the world
"The end-time has come. Hundreds of millions will die in the worst time of tribulation the world has ever known. You need to be informed so you can know how to respond."
(Ronnie Weinland's COG-PKG website)
Weinland claims that "this coming year (2007) is the preparation year for the church (His Church), he claims that 2008 is the year of the final witness to the world."
(WCG Alumni post)
The End is nigh! Prophecy is being fulfilled!
Since the disappointment of 1972, any number of self-appointed "watchmen" have been waggling their tonsils and announcing the impending tribulation. Take Willie Dankenbring for example. "His latest significant failure was in stating that Bill Clinton would be successor to Kofi Annan as the U.N. Secretary" (WCG Alumni post)
The method of preference is "strongly suggested possibility." The typical Herbal Prophet begins with tentative phrases such as "could it be that next year will see X happen?" ... then they proceed as if it's a dead certainty before exhorting the sheep to "dig deep" for the final push.
Then they blame the sheep for jumping to conclusions when nothing happens!
But back to Ronnie. The former UCG elder, now running his very own designer sect, COG-PKG, has written a book all about 2008. And lo, he doesn't seem to be prevaricating about his chosen dates. Thus saith Ronnie:
"From now until the latter part of 2008, many prophecies are going to begin to be fulfilled, especially the Seven Thunders of the Book of Revelation, which the apostle John saw but was restricted from recording. Those thunders are revealed in this book, as well as detailed accounts of the final three and one-half years of man's self-rule on earth, which are recorded in the account of the Seventh Seal of Revelation.
"Some of these prophecies concern the demise of the United States over the next two years, which will be followed by man's final world war."
But let's cheat and flick to the last page of this insightful opus:
"As the spokesman of God’s two end-time witnesses and as His end-time prophet, I have fulfilled my responsibility in placing the contents of this book before you. What you do with it is up to you. Indeed, only a very short time remains before it will be evident that I am who I say or that I am not [Yes, it's all about Ronnie - GR]. In the past 1900 years, have you ever read or heard of a publication from any religious leader who has made such claims, laying out such a precise pattern for the near future with such precise timelines? You have not! [Yes we have! - GR] This is the evidence (witness, testimony) of the true God of Abraham!"
And pretty shonky evidence it is.
To his credit he's not selling the thing. You can get a copy for free either in hard copy or via download, and hey, I suggest you do. A perfect demonstration of the blind stupidity of the "prophecy marches on" mentality. Drag it out in 2009 and, once you've checked your kneecaps*, rejoice in the knowledge that the world is still here and that, despite all our human failings, the Super-Fascist Kingdom of Ron has not arrived.
Now THAT'S Good News!
*"Every knee shall bow," which led the Armstrong exegetes to speculate that the returning Christ might need to use his "rod of iron" to smash a few kneecaps in order to achieve the desired outcome.
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Mental illness is the number one inspiration for religious books on the end times..., and a leading source of unending inspiration for those devoid of mind. End time prophecies which come alive always do so in the lifetime of the author, until he dies.
It was the late Douglas Adams in one of the five books of his trilogy about "The Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy" -- "Restaurant at the End of the Universe", I think, where would be prophets came to proclaim the message of the two pillars of the Universe, but always slinked away when they realized that they didn't have a clue what the message was.
It was October this year that I talked with a former member of the UCG congregation which had the Ronmeister as the cultmeister, departed for the land of the Mental Hospital without meds. The man told me that he had been attending there and was disfellowshipped when he did not accept the idea that Ronny Boy was a prophet. There were secret meetings. The UCG ejected Weinland unceremoniously and people pretty much went on with their lives, except, of course, for those who shared the Folie à deux -- an exceptional dedication for the predilection of following an insane person gone bonkers with a few fries short of a happy meal. To say that the Ron Elevator doesn't reach the top floor ignores the fact that it's still in the basement. The man told me about the horrid news that Ron Weinland also declared that he was one of the two witnesses. Like other cultmeisters gone AWOL from sanity's clutches, he has embraced the self-importance of narcissism which precludes caring about other people, and by the report I received became appropriately dismissive and abusive -- not unlike of another report around the same time that the leadership of the CGG had followed the same broad path with steep and dangerously deep ditches.
If you check it out, you can see the progression:
"The Prophesied End Time";
"Time is Running Out";
"Time has Run Out";
"2008 - God's Final Witness".
Personally, I think that it would have been better to have waited and rolled all three of the previous into the "Witness" book, since they cover the same destitute territory of disease, destruction, death.
As one who has had an opportunity to visit the mental ward often visiting a family member, it is clear where the author belongs. The people I meet and talk to there believe they are special people when they are off their meds. Some believe God talks to them directly because they hear His Voice in their heads. The only real difference between them and Ronnie Wienland is that he has a following and takes in tithes. That, and he doesn't take meds. The meds would help. Certainly, the Holy Spirit has obviously hasn't given him a sound mind, so what other alternative is left to keep him stable. Writing booklets hardly qualifies.
It is now with boldness, confidence and great clarity that I give to you what God has given me. I am to announce, through God’s
direct revelation, that I am one of those two witnesses.
Ah yes, yet another THAT PROPHET that speaks through: Since God speaks through him, then you have to follow him and believe what he says, because he is the only one from whom you will find the truth. Whenever there is a contradiction to what he says now from Scripture, it is the Bible which is wrong. Therefore, the tautology is complete in an endless downward spiral which ends in going fruit loops. This is a strategy from Gerald Flurry, who, we must admit, is actually much better at it. Take lessons Ron.
I am to say as Moses said, “I AM has sent me to you.”
There are those voices again. Get help from a mental health professional ... soon.
This is not a time to “wait and see,” although most will do so for as long as they can.
Gavin is right. Wait until 2009. At least with that false prophet, Pat Roberson, who predicted that the Pacific Northwest (Seattle area) would suffer a tsaumi this year, we have fewer than 6 weeks to wait to be able to cast the first stones [because we just don't make false prophecies around here]. It's a shame we have to wait longer with "Witless", but it's not too long to wait three more years just to be certain the guy is stone cold nuts.
Do you get tired of lies? Do you recognize how many lies you are constantly being told? We have become desensitized to lying since it has become such a normal part of living. Lying is the outcome of people being right in their own eyes and stubbornly holding to their own viewpoint, regardless of evidence to the contrary.
Religion is the greatest culprit of all when it comes to lying and
By the fall of 2008, the United States will have collapsed as a world power, or it will have begun its collapse and no longer exist as an independent nation within six months after that time.
Is this self-parody? It certainly seems like it.
The only think I can say is the booklet is full of words. Meaningless words. Give us some proof, Ronny Boy: Call down fire from heaven; Prove your humility -- give three examples. It takes a lot less faith to print a meaningless booklet.
What is so amazing is that people swallow this recycled crap from the CoG cesspool. You'd have thought that not one fulfilled prophecy during the life time of Herbert Armstrong should be a clue to the cluess, but it isn't. How many times do people have to go through this? C'mon! Make new mistakes at least. Do something creative. It would seem that explaining the Seven Seals and the 144,000 has now become a cottage industry amongst the church of gods and this is no exception, although it would be refreshing to have an original thought now and then.
Or better yet, stop wasting electrons downloading this electronic drivel and stop allowing some crackpot to map current news to events which don't track.
Sanity is at stake here.
At this point, the only viable use for tithes would be to buy the meds. They aren't the churches of God, they are individual mental wards scattered around the world.
"As the spokesman of God’s two end-time witnesses and as His end-time prophet, I have fulfilled my responsibility in placing the contents of this book before you."
Okay, I know about the Two Witnesses, but somebody clue me in please -- where does Weinland get this "spokesman of God's two end-time witnesses" stuff? If he's their spokesman, then they must be here at last. And yet the news media seem to be suppressing all those accounts of droughts and fire from heaven and divine plagues that the Two Witnesses must be inflicting on the wicked.
Anyway, why do the Two Witnesses need a spokesman? Would prophets of God really need a press secretary or a P.R. guy?
Incidentally, I find it, um, interesting that Gavin's post appeared today of all days, when the Catholic Church's lectionary cycle includes a reading from Rev. 11:3-12. If I were still an Armstrongist, I might wonder if there is anything of divine significance in that coincidence. But I'm not, so I'll just note the interesting coincidence.
I find it interesting that all these splinter groups claim when Christ will return. Not even Christ knows when the Father will ask him to come. But these humans think they can out guess God on the time frame.
This prediction actually is somewhat of a match with what a well-known U.S. religious radio network is claiming.
Family Radio's Harold Camping has a book called Time Has an End, in which he claims Jesus will come and end Earth's history in the fall of 2011. That's three-and-a-half years after the "final witness."
But I should note Camping also thought this would happen in 1994. He now explains this was when the "Church era" ended.
P.S. I didn't know the Church of God came in a package!
No man(or woman) knows the day or the hour, and probably the year,also, of Christ's coming.
It's amazing how many seem to overlook this verse. It's there for all to see,large as life.
Why don't they heed it..indeed, the witlesses are at work again.
We've all been exposed to movies, TV programs, and novels dealing with the topic of unrequited love. I submit that what we're witnessing within the fragmented Armstrong diaspora is a case of unrequited theology!
These folks have based their entire lives on the prophecies of their "Elijah", and now they'd like to see the prophecies fulfilled before they die. 1975 didn't faze them, they did not find any of the allegations regarding the corruption of their apostle to be credible, and they've continued to believe in even the most easily disprovable of the so-called "18 Restored Truths" such as British Israelism.
As they anxiously await the Germans, I expect that there will be great mental turmoil. I sincerely hope that rational, realistic thinking will ultimately prevail, and that no tragedies occur amongst our former brethren as they witness the undeniable final debunking of the man to whom they entrusted, in many cases, their entire human lives.
All we can do is to stand by and be prepared to help as many of them as possible to adjust.
The last thirty years of the twentieth century saw three massive defections of ministers and members alike in the Worldwide Church of God: 1974, c. 1979-1980, and 2005-2006. Were any of these related to failed prophecies? Did any of you leave over failed prophecies?
Personally, I was prepared to ignore failed "speculations" as long as I believed that the WCG was God's true church. Recognizing that HWA made specific predictions that failed again and again only bothered me, despite scriptural admonitions against false prophets, after I'd lost faith in the organization for other reasons.
I was a student in '71 when the first end of time in my stint in WCG was at hand. 1972 was to be a biggie. Every day I passed the hole in the ground that was becoming the Ambassador Auditorium. I did wonder at bible study when when we were all being motivated by '72, why were rather permanent buildings being laid down at the same time? I sensed a disconnect between the mental habits of preaching and basking in the success they were having at the time as an organization. Anyway, God moved in in '72 but was evicted sometime after the turn of the century and hasn't been seen since.
I’m really glad that I got out of the WCG and its affiliates. The history of those organizations sickens me today when I look back because of the way they treated people and the very structure of the thing (hierarchal). The “special” people got all the attention and all the money while the hard-working “members” were told to sit down and shut up (even though they were paying for the whole shebang). Whenever I hear of one of the ex-ministers proclaiming such-and-such or so-and-so as if our Creator were speaking exclusively through him I get the urge to…Well, I won’t go there.
I just get sick and tired of these con men raping people that are desperate to believe in SOMETHING in this sick and twisted world we live in. The Christ warned his people that this would happen, but for some reason the blinders are left on. It’s always THEM (outsiders) that are blind—never the COGers.
I don’t know when the Great Trouble is going to occur and neither does anyone else. I have the same Bible in front of me that they have and it doesn’t have any dates printed in the margins relating to end-time prophecy. Maybe I didn’t buy mine from the right publisher.
I fell for the lies once, so I can’t condemn the followers of these wolves in sheep’s clothing. But I can see the damage done to the Name of Christ by people that are proclaiming they represent Him. It’s no wonder that the Bible says that mankind will fight Him at His return.
Coming not so soon...
"2008 in Prophecy"
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not let any KOOKS like Weinland or Flurry, et al., near that big red nuclear launch button!
For I am surely convinced that they would push it, just to see their own darn "prophecies" come true!
My inaugural address at the Great White Throne Judgment of the Dead, after I have raptured out billions!
Read My Inaugural Address
If a person seriously reads the New Testament it becomes obvious that the "end time" was in the lifetime of the apostles.
All the "this generation", "at hand", "soon", "quickly" and "shortly" passages (more than a hundred of 'em)points to that conclusion.
So, either the "end time" happened and the preterists are right and all prophecy has been fulfilled or the New Testament writers are liars, take your choice.
If the "end of the age" was at the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD then it stands to reason that we are living in the "age to come", i.e., "the new heavens and the new earth" which is supposed to last forever.
Other implications are that the city called "Mystery Babylon" is Jerusalem and not Rome. The "two witnesses" would nearly have to be Peter and James, since they were the apostles in Jerusalem (forgetting the Catholic tradition of them dying in Rome, of course).
This would also mean that the return of Christ, the resurrection and white throne judgment was in 70 AD (invisibly, of course). The "lake of fire" would be the burning of the city, the false prophet would be the "Judas of Galilee" mentioned by Josephus in book 18 of "Antiquities of the Jews".
Either it happened or it didn't happen. If it did happen then the apostles are vindicated. If it didn't happen then they are liars.
There is one thing for certain, they were talking about it coming to pass in their lifetime, not ours.
"The 'two witnesses' would nearly have to be Peter and James, since they were the apostles in Jerusalem (forgetting the Catholic tradition of them dying in Rome, of course)."
There is no Catholic tradition of Peter and James dying in Rome. History records that James was killed in Jerusalem in 62 A.D. (as we see in Josephus) and that Peter was killed a few years later in Rome. The location of Peter's death and burial is unanimously attested in Christian documents of the second century, and perhaps the first century if Clement's reference to the martyrdoms of Peter and Paul means, as is most likely, that they had been martyred in Rome. There is also the archaeological evidence -- the fact that Peter's tomb is in Rome. History is as clear as possible (as clear as it can be for events of the first century) that James died in Jerusalem and Peter died in Rome. As for tradition, it's significant that there is no other account of Peter's death but the one mentioned in the earliest historical sources. As important a figure in the early Church as Peter was, surely some other church would claim to be the place of his death and burial if there had been the slightest doubt in the early Church about how and where the "first" of the Twelve apostles died.
As for Jerusalem being the Great Whore of Babylon, that interpretation does seem to make some sort of sense. Unfortunately there is no trace of that interpretation anywhere in the early Church. Rather, "Babylon" is always said to be a codename for Rome, not Jerusalem.
I don't put stock in much of Preterist thought, in part because it seems to arise from too linear a sense of time, and presses the original Christians' sense of immediacy about the coming of Christ's Kingdom much further than I think is safe. The words of Jesus in the Olivet prophecy can sound like the end would indeed come in the lifetimes of the original disciples, but they also include cautions against assuming that the end has really come or is about to come. Jesus is also recorded as saying that the Kingdom was in the very midst of the Jews, and that He is the resurrection and the life. In other words, the New Testament teaches that the Kingdom and the resurrection of the dead already happened even before Christ's crucifixion. And yet the New Testament also says they are yet to come.
Either we have a flat-out contradiction, or Christian beliefs about the Last Things is rather more complicated that the hardline Preterists and hardline Futurists like to think. Past, present, and future all collapse in the presence of the Eternal God.
Anyway, the biggest problem with the Preterist identification of 70 A.D. as the year of the end of the world, the final judgment, the resurrection of the dead, and the coming of the new heavens and new earth is that it is undeniable that none of those things happened in 70 A.D. If in doubt, just take a drive past your local cemetery today and ask the groundskeeper if all of those graves are empty, or ask your local coroner or medical examiner if people have stopped dying yet. (Interestingly enough, St. Paul does warn against heretics who claimed that the resurrection of the dead had already happened.)
Prophecy is the sparking battery that empowers many cults. It is used to generate fear, excitement self-congratulation and a willingness to donate money. A nice package all around for a ministry that has no other virtues. Armstrongism is full of prophecy hounds who either secretly or overtly want to see this society (and all else they resent) crash in flames while they are comfortably tucked away in some resort-like place of safety. In this regard, we find them sitting next to some of the Islamic fundamentalists who regard the USA as the "Great Satan." There is also a strong element of this in evangelical Christianity. The popularity of the LaHaye books attests to this.
Take away the spin on prophecy and many of these derivative churches deflate into pallid little collections of eccentrics.
I would challenge, along with Douglas Becker, anyone to show us one prophecy that has been fulfilled since 70AD. Not an interpretation based on text-proofed misconceptions, but a real honest to goodness fulfilled prophecy.
I would also say that any "informed" preterist would obviously exclude the return of Christ as an event fulfilled in or before 70AD. Unless, of course, one believes that Jesus "returned" to the disciples in the form of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost.
I am not, at this time, one that is convinced that Ron Weinland is one of the two witnesses. I will say he has laid out a timeline, with very specific details, in a way that no other Church of God minister, to my knowledge, has done.
It is clear that almost all members of the Church of God consider him a crackpot.(actually to be accurate most members are not even aware of him, but if they are think he's a nut) Certainly those who no longer believe in Church of God doctrines, as I think is true of many, if not most, of the readers of this web site would place him at the extreme of the "lunatic fringe" of COGdom.
I agree that there have been cultic elements in the Church of God and there has been much abuse. That said, I still firmly believe in the basic doctrines of the Church of God. I have not allowed myself to be abused for over 20 years. I know, many of you believe this is impossible, that just being in a Church of God group is abuse enough, and I understand that thinking.
Perhaps some that have completely disassociated from the COG still think that the prophetic outline the church has taught for years( although used in an abusive way in many cases; that is, for money gain,to "prove" they are the only true church, etc.) still has validity. I don't know. All the false predictions have created a real credibility problem.
Without a doubt there are groups in the Church of God world that are led by men that are, to put it nicely, unbalanced in their thinking. Are they sincere? I hope so. I cannot make that judgement and neither can anyone else. That is something only God can do.
Ron Weinland is, and I know we don't want to believe this, a man to watch. The specifics he lays out will show, without a doubt, in the next 2 years, whether he is a nut or who he is claiming to be.
If one still believes in God one must believe this one thing. God has a plan. It is insanity to think, if one believes in God, that God does not have a plan. A point, from my perspective, that should be carefully considered in the context of prophecy and how God has worked and what he reveals to man. Thinking people do realize we do NOT live in normal times.
One must give him credit for one thing at this point. He has "gone out on a limb" in a way no other Church of God minister has in the past 2000 years, to our knowledge.That does take guts. I know, most look at it as a scam. Time---a very short time---will tell
"One must give him (Ron Weinland) credit for one thing at this point. He has "gone out on a limb" in a way no other Church of God minister has in the past 2000 years, to our knowledge."
I find this statement to be mistaken. This view needs to be informed by the history of Armstrongism. I recall telling a friend back in the late Sixties that HWA had gone out on a limb and if his prophecies did not happen in the "next few short years" (to quote the many co-worker letters), that HWA would be demonstrated to be a false prophet. Here it is 2006, HWA is dead and after many revisions of HWA's prophetic timetables, there are still people who believe in some version of what HWA predicted.
The same will be true of Ron Weinland. His prophetic interpretations will be re-treaded and re-treaded and will still be spinning decades from now. Everybody will forget that there is reason to doubt the credibility of his assertions. Prophecy has a life of its own. It meets the various needs of those who are pre-occupied with it so they perpetuate it.
This is really odd to me because I knew Ron Weinland back in Kansas. I talked to him down at Big Sandy when he was still a student (I think he did some time at Bricket Wood). He always seemed very level headed. He never struck me as the type who would become a prophecy weenie. But like Jimmy Durante used to say "Everybody wants to get into the act."
At this page>http://the-end.com/RonaldWeinland.asp
old Ronnie is sitting in what appears to be Herbie favorite chair (did he buy this at an auction?) with his head cocked sideways. Is this a subtle hint that he is a herbal replacement?
Please Ronnie, say it ain't so...
Whoops, I guess I was mistaken in my belief that the Bible is absolutely silent about persons like Ron Weinland and Herbert Armstrong. It turns out that Jesus prophesied their 'ministries' in Luke 21:8 --
"Pay attention so that you aren't deceived, for many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and 'The time has come.' Do not follow them!"
I actually went to a public library on Thursday afternoons over a period of several months during the 1980's, and proved the prophecies of Daniel 11 -- right down to the events of 1917.
It's too much to post here, but it was downright inspiring.
"right down to the events of 1917"
Why nothing after 1917?
According to jared olar:
"Anyway, the biggest problem with the Preterist identification of 70 A.D. as the year of the end of the world, the final judgment, the resurrection of the dead, and the coming of the new heavens and new earth is that it is undeniable that none of those things happened in 70 A.D. If in doubt, just take a drive past your local cemetery today and ask the groundskeeper if all of those graves are empty, or ask your local coroner or medical examiner if people have stopped dying yet. (Interestingly enough, St. Paul does warn against heretics who claimed that the resurrection of the dead had already happened.)"
The preterist view is that the resurrection etc. was/is invisible to humans. Jesus was the only one to be bodily resurrected.
The heretics who claimed that the resurrection was "past already" were making this claim before 70 AD.
A good question is, if they were expecting a visible, physical resurrection how could those heretics "overthrow the faith of some"?
The end is nigh,
This world is sick,
So heave a sigh
And REPANT quick.
Tribulation to all
Who do not hurry
And heed the call
Of PROFIT Flurry.
“The preterist view is that the resurrection etc. was/is invisible to humans. Jesus was the only one to be bodily resurrected.”
If so, then the preterist view is not a Christian view, since the doctrine of the bodily resurrection not only of Jesus but of all humans (whether it is visible or not) has been held universally by orthodox Christians from the very beginning, as attested by scripture and extrabiblical testimony as well.
“The heretics who claimed that the resurrection was ‘past already’ were making this claim before 70 AD.”
Ah, so they were just a few years too early, eh?
“A good question is, if they were expecting a visible, physical resurrection how could those heretics ‘overthrow the faith of some’?”
Who are “they”? Do you mean the heretics or the Christians? If “they” means the Christians, there is no question they were expecting a physical resurrection and glorification of their bodies. If heretics convinced any Christians that their expectation was erroneous, that would overthrow the faith of those Christians who they might mislead into thinking the resurrection was already past.
Every one is entitled to their opinion concerning this new book.
If I had 10 billion to bet that this is where God is working I would take your bet. I have no
history with WCG or any scattered
group that exist. Then a funny
event happened to me January 27th,
2005. I was reading the Dallas
Morning News and came across a
FREE book. All I had to do was
order it on a website or mail in
for it. I recieved it, read it,
and understood the TRUE Church
for the first time in my life. I
stopped attending the Methodist
church around 15 years of age.
Now I realizied this was strange
to understand but I was ready to
correctly restart my journey with
God. I finally attended a Sabbath
service on July 2,2005. I had sent
many e-mails to the books author
since early June 2005. I told him
I had seen the ad in the DMN some
months back. He stated that NO ad
had ever been placed in the DMN.
He mentioned the John 6:44 verse
that day in his sermon. I was sure
that I had been called out; but
why me. By the way, the author of
the book: Ronald Weinland / its
title: The Prophesied End-Time
Time will tell others where God is,
I only hope they begin to listen.
Glen in Texas
Study the Bible as RCM says we should all do. When you study, really study, and precious few Americans do, you will discover that there were many dissentions in God's chruch all through church history. This does not take away, diminish, or refute the truth of God contained within the pages of the Bible and preached with clarity by RCM.
I know alot of you are rambling on and on about mental illness, delusions of grandeur, false prophecies, etc. etc.
I'm a man who knows Ronald Weinland. I've known him for multiple years. If there is one thing that I can say about him it is that he is far from insane and he is far from egotistical. In fact Ronald Weinland is one of the most down to earth individuals I've ever met.
This whole forum is dedicated to bitterness and frankly it reeks of a spirit not inspired from above. Just look at all the bloated hatred you all spew in every which way. Regardless of your opinion, pro or con, shouldn't a Christian attitude be one of sympathy and concern instead of bitterness?
A lot of bad things have happened in the various COGs, I've spent years researching it and digging to the bottom of it all to wrap my brain around it. Sadly, the history is filled with individuals like those here on this forum dedicated not to any semblance of decency but simply tearing down (and if the truth stands in your way, who cares?)
If you want to talk about his book, why don't you actually read it so you won't appear so foolish along with full of blind hatred? You'll see that he's not in the same mold as Herbert W. Armstrong- he deviates from a lot of his positions on prophecy. He also addresses the foolish "No man knows the day or the hour" statement (If Christ is opening the seven seals of Revelation, wouldn't he now know a timeline?)
If you want actual prophecies- read the book. He's stated very boldly specific individuals are going to die and in what order (Rod Meredith, Richard Ames, Gerald Flurry, Dave Pack, John Ritenbaugh). If that's not a specific prophecy, what is? And obviously there's not a whole lot of time to wait for that fulfillment.
And what are you sad tormented souls going to do when your sources of entertainment are gone?
Ronald Weinland is a good and honest man, humble and dedicated to overcoming base human nature (you know, the one epitomized and displayed here by most present). And in the grand scheme of things, does anything else matter but that? Can any of you honestly claim similar?
There are few ministers that believe the same thing. Christ knows the body. He can see the light of men so those who are of a dark understanding he also knows. Wheat and tears together till whatever the end is. The end of ones life or the end of the age. But, one thing is certain, God is always on time with whatever he does. Mens prophecies can fail and there is nothing new under the sun.
When we look at the Bible and when we look at what the Bible says we can see that there is a plan of God. God has had prophets( People who gave god's word). I have read both books that Ron Weinland has written because he is leading people from independent congregations of COG fellowships of which I am a pastor of one of these groups. This is not the first prophet self proclaimed. The book the end time prophesies is more of a history of God's church and a timeline of God's Sabbath keeping people than anything else. We know that God has a plan, 6000 years have passed. Time is short and we are closer to the end than yesterday. It is easy to predict a financial collapse in this country, we know it is going to happen sooner or later. We know that the end is nearer than farther. God has told us that the people of God will be scattered because of Daniel 12. There will be small congregations, both home and small groups meeting in buildings. Ron weinland will be proven one way or the other within the next six months. He has named some number of days in both sermons and publications for the opening of seals and trumpets. I caution everyone Do not say that he is a false prophet until the prophecies that he gives do not come to pass. At that time it will be evident, but until then we should heed the story about Elijah, when he was taunted by young men saying you are not a prophet of God and they were destroyed. We must also be wise, watching and praying for the kingdom of God.
independent COG pastor.
Isn't Bibleman supposed to save us?
i have just came back from jerslam if u have problems going to isreal i will come with u to make sure u complete your task
stephen collins/ firstname.lastname@example.org
The signs are here, wars, earthquakes, tsunamis, cyclones, global warming, and false prophets...
These are what the bible calls, the beginning of birth pains. The signs of the end times. On September 11, 2001 New York was attacked in one of the worst attacks in recent history. About 2,985 people lost there lives that day. A few years later a Tsunami destroyed the majority of
A few years later, there was a massive hurricane in New Orleans where 1,836 people lost there lives.
Shortly after that a tsunami in indonesia killed nearly 200,000 people.
The Iraq war has lost nearly 3000 soldiers during this fight, along with over 1 million iraqi civillians, and children.
A few days ago in Burma, a cyclone destroyed nearly all the homes and as of today nearly 30,000 people have died.
All these things have been written before hand in the bible, and the bible especially in the book of Matthew Ch 24, Jesus Christ talks about the end times to his disciples. Jesus Christ clearly says "Take heed that no man deceive you.
For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
He goes on to give his disciples more warnings, and people like YOU and ME have read this in The Bible, so therefore no one should believe a man who says he is GOD or JESUS CHRIST...
Jesus Christ clearly say's how he will return towards the end of Matthew Ch 24 "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."
I encourage all of you to read The Bible and to follow your heart and put all your faith in Jesus Christ, but please, please do not let no man deceive you because it has been written that many will come and deceive this nation.
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