One of the few redeeming features of the WCG was its policy of never sending unsolicited literature. If you were exposed to The Plain Truth or one of the scores of booklets it was always because you asked for it.The various splinter groups invariably hew to this policy: UCG, LCG, PCG, CGI, ICG, COG-AIC, CBCG etc. We should be thankful for small mercies
So imagine my surprise when I received an unsolicited packet from the local franchisee of the Robert Ardis cult (Church of God's Faithful), Wally Lawton.
It's not that I know Wally: I don't, except by reputation. Wally was formerly a heavyweight with the NZ branch of PCG before leaving some months back. He has since become "Regional Director" for Ardis, who previously split from PCG.
A couple of "inquiring minds" questions...
First: where did the mailing list come from Wally? A lot of folk have been contacted in this way. Where did the addresses come from?
Second: why is Wally sending out unwanted mail to people who've expressed zero interest in his church, especially as this clearly violates the precedent set by Ardis' idol, Herbert Armstrong?
I don't know much about the Ardis group, but what little I do know is more than enough.
The first time I ignored it, but today there was more in the mail: a glossy postcard hawking the Ardis booklet on healing. One can only imagine the quality of counsel it provides.
How many more went out to unwilling recipients?
Wally, stop it!
32 comments:
Just another "One True" church!
My question?
What's the difference between CoG-Faithful and CoG-Faithful Flock?
Other than the addition of "flock"?
I too am disheartened to see another repudiations of the medical sciences, and I wonder how many lives Rob and Wally will literally lose, before they "get back on track" and come to their senses?
As to why they've started spamming, it's surely a sign of how desperate they are to get butts in seats. Things must be so dire around those parts, Rob and Wally are probably the ONLY "CoG-Faithful" left. Given that they're sending out a "healing booklet" though, it's no surprise........
My unsolicited copy went straight into the rubbish, unread. I, too, wondered how on earth he got my name and address.
If Wally knew what some folk say about him, his ears would tingle.
Robert Ardis, has some interesting things to say, his view point the resurrection appears at Pentecost (mirror's Fred Coulter's). Though there are differences in some interpretations.
The statement of beliefs indicates a growth of NEW TRUTH in the last 7 years.
Unfortunately a lot of their material is to expose PCG as the real Laodiceans; that some of us not related to PCG politics would have no interest in studying.
Robert said...
Unfortunately a lot of their material is to expose PCG as the real Laodiceans; that some of us not related to PCG politics would have no interest in studying.
There's at least one group out there that calls themselves the Laodecian Church of God. Strange, but a refreshingly honest perspective!
One can imagine the argument "You're the Laodecian era!" to which the reply is: "Why yes we are, so nice of you to notice!".
I've got a friend who's father worked very closely for HWA for years. Not that anyone would know his name offhand. Upset over WCG changes my friend's father has been thinking of which Armstrongist camp to go to. He's tellng all this to his son, who's an evangelical. He says "I'm thinking of joining Gerald Flurrys group because they are the only one growing, and they look an awful like the WCG in the old days." My friend tells his dad "are you crazy? Once you join them, He's not going to let you associate with me or your grandchildren!".
I don't know if he's still thinking of joing Flurry or not, but he clearly didn't think thru the consequences.
Everyone seems so interested in classifying one group or another as "Philadelphian" or "Laodicean". Don't you folks realize that these classifications apply to the whole church and all of Christianity? God is inclusive, and is concerned about everyone, not just one small group.
Having said that, there is little doubt that the Church of God is the point on the spear. That is true because it is so far ahead of the other churches in spiritual knowledge, Biblical and prophetic understanding, and doctrinal truth.
However, great faith is found in most if not all the other churches! God does not play favorites. Every group has their own role to play.
What is interesting is that as the WCG has evolved over the years, the other "mainstream" churches have followed suit, knowingly or unknowingly. For instance, the WCG no longer really has to talk about Biblical prophecy, because everyone else is now doing it.
Other churches have also begun to see that while they condemned us of being "legalistic", they are realizing that they too, were in fact VERY legalistic. The Baptists and Catholics immediately come to mind.
Oh, let them send all the postcards and materials they want. Every piece that comes to you means money out of their pocket.
And you can recycle.
A "growth of new truth" -- at the time when there supposedly will be a "famine of the word"?
Which Scriptures do they twist, to come up with that one?
It’s not just New Zealand.Unsolicited mail must be a policy of this group.
I am in the UK, and received a booklet a couple of months back, followed by a postcard a couple of weeks later. Never heard of them before, had to check internet is see just which splinter they had come from.
While it is true that this goes against the general COG policy of never sending unsolicited mail, I had received unsolicited mail from PCG in the past, (which is where Robert Ardis came from).
Probably about 1996 an unasked for ‘Malachi’s Message’ arrived, followed by a subscription to the Philadelphia Trumpet. It was addressed just to my surname (not even a Mr. – but not surprising as that is a title reserved for ministers!!).
At least yours wasn’t just addressed to ‘Rumney’.
Unfortunately a lot of their material is to expose PCG as the real Laodiceans;
Just more Ardis error. The PCG is NOT Laodicean. The PCG IS Satanic. That is the REAL problem.
Considering that all the Churches of God worship the Demiurge, that doesn't exactly put PCG ahead of the --- er --- Pack, now does it? ;-)
Have they booklets? Yes I am interested in all these "new" truths. The way fuel prices are rising, they will help heat the house this winter and cut my bill!
They say:
"Herbert Armstrong accomplished his commission of taking the Gospel to the world."
They say(in their Statement of Belief):
"We believe that from the point of Mr. Armstrong's death, the 'Temple' was completed and no more would be called into the Church EXCEPT a very few from the 'highways and the hedges and the streets and lanes of the city' "
So, why the mailings to solicit interest?
Are they looking for a few more tithers?
By the way, I think the above quotes are how couch-sitters in Living Room Churches of God look at it.
That way, they can believe they are 'called', AND 'chosen', and they don't have to participate in any "getting out the gospel"
They can concentrate on the all important work of mutual back-patting and reveling in delusions of grandeur.
~Mel
Hey---
It could be worse! They could telemarket you, or even worse, come to your door!
They've got to get a little bit more creative though with their marketing. If they just included a little something, like a Pot Holder, or Flashlight pen, or even a Cracker Jack box "rub on tattoo" then I would welcome all junk mail.
Lussenheide
"We believe that from the point of Mr. Armstrong's death, the 'Temple' was completed and no more would be called into the Church EXCEPT a very few from the 'highways and the hedges and the streets and lanes of the city' "
You mean stragglers like, oh, the whole country of China?
So much for preaching the gospel to the whole world.
My advice to Wally: Ramp up to send your next mailing to China. You could make quite an impression with the Summer Olympics there this year and all.
I once got some un-asked-for mail from PCG. Some members of my WCG congregation had gone there a month or two before, and I presume one of them gave them my name and address. I assumed their MPC knew it was not I who asked for it.
Bill Lussenheide said...
They've got to get a little bit more creative though with their marketing. If they just included a little something, like a Pot Holder, or Flashlight pen, or even a Cracker Jack box "rub on tattoo" then I would welcome all junk mail.
Rub-on graven images! HWA PEZ Candy! The one true flashlight! ROTFL!!!
I feel slighted not to have received a bulging packet from the COG Faithful.
Mind you, I was presented with a CD and booklet which were rendered asunder by the kitchen scissors.
Christ has made a secret visit to this earth? Sounds like they are a throwback to the days of Peter Waldo.Based on the appellation of that church, I wonder what we should call its modern counterpart?
Any ideas?
Cheers,
Jorgheinz
We should all request their literature; all of it. Maybe it would bankrupt them.
BH
Bamboo_bends said...
Just another "One True" church!
No, just another one more true mythology
We had the "Cadaver Church of God" here in the hood not long ago. I thought it well named, but when I 'esplained to them that that would not be the "all one body we" they might be looking for in a name, they took it down. :) The Pic did make it into various blogs however.
Personally, I am a Lao-ephetyranian-pergamosa-delphian.
How come no one is the Ephesian era anymore where they try those that say they are apostles and find them wanting. It's not like we don't have enough to pick on!
I was sent home from Catachism classes once for goofing off..so does that make me and Apostle..as one who was "sent."? I think sooooooooooo!
Should we save these unsolicited mail pieces to turn over to the Germans? (I speak as a fool).
BB
It's very sad to see the church of god splinters pushing the healing doctrine. Back in the 1920's, I could see people believing this. Medical science could show no better results than "annointing" and "healing". But today, all one has to do is compare the advances in medical science from the 1950's to present with the very dismal record of the healing practices of WCG and its daughters. Look at the results, folks, its there for all to see!
The Skeptic
The Skeptic said...
It's very sad to see the church of god splinters pushing the healing doctrine.
I was healed of asthma at age 7. And I had it bad. Haven't had it since. A WCG minister annoited me.
Does everyone get healed who seeks it? No. Neither does it have anything to do with correct or incorrect beliefs. Mormons and lots of other faiths experience healings too. Strange how impartial God is.
Have I gone to doctors? You bet I have! I have never excluded going to them.
Do I trust doctors? I do a good deal of research on the doctors that work on me. I want the best ones.
I don't trust cost-cutting hospitals much, they gave my elderly father-in-law multiple resistant CDIFF and MR Pneumonia because of their lax cleanliness. Both completely avoidable infections.
Re Healing. Read the article Will God Heal You? at www.cgom.org in the articles sector
Anonymous said...
Re Healing. Read the article Will God Heal You? at www.cgom.org in the articles sector
Why would I do that? They've got no corner on the healing market.
Heck there's Reiki people out there healing people every day.
My point was healing does happen outside the medical system. But if my appendix bursts, I'm heading for the nearest hospital.
As far as I am concerned, seeing my wife's eyesight restored by laser surgery was every bit the miracle as Jesus fixing the blind. "And greater works than this shall they do...."
In the West, if you can't cut it out, burn it out or poison it, we run out of ideas quickly.
The mind/body connection is only now becoming more mainstream in healing.
Fibromyalgia, which is simply , "my muscles hurt" is often connected to depression and I personally feel that unaddressed anger and resentment can become the cancer that finally eats us. Environmental factors are also a cause of course.
If indeed, we are a "spirit trapped for now in a limited five sensed carbon based wetsuit" then it can help a lot to restate our illnesses. "My body is having a challenge with cancer. The I that is me is fine." It's a major paradigm shift in who we think we are and can go a long way in healing.
We can rant at how Church "healing" was administered or explained, but the Bible says what it says and, while it does not work and should never have been THE way to health sincere people end up feeling defective and faithless when healing doesn't come to pass.
"Why won't God heal me?" goes a long way in depressing the spirit and works against healing. We need to make use of all avenues of healing including changing our perspectives and attitudes about who and what we are, or may be.
I was healed of asthma at age 7. And I had it bad. Haven't had it since. A WCG minister annoited me."
Poor God. Can heal asthma and incurable brain cancer but can't heal a single amputee. His ways are mysterious indeed.
Paul Ray
I was cured of Biblio Crani-itis, which is a swelling of cranium due to over stuffing it with the Bible.
Three times I ask for healing and the first time shrinkage was seen in the Law, the Writings and the Prophets section.
The second time, there was almost no sign of any harmony of the Gospels anywhere.
The third time, Paul's letters just disappeared. They say I never had any pseudopigrapha of Paul, which was encouraging. That stuff is envasive! They say I will first notice that I no longer will have an urge to be all things to all men. We'll see!
There was some concern the Book of Revelation might not be curable, but they think I never really had that either.
The doctors were amazed
Some of the evangelicals on Christian radio and television have identified 1.8 billion people in the world who have never even heard the gospel of Jesus Christ once. They are targetting these people, and attempting to remedy the situation.
It is extremely arrogant to assert that Herbert W. Armstrong completed the commission to go into all the world and reach everyone with the gospel.
Moreover, if one does not believe that the commission has been fulfilled, it extremely naieve to believe that the splinters are doing this in any meaningful way. They are all quite lame.
Yet another ridiculous dilemma or conundrum associated with Armstrongism.
BB
Say Paul:
There was that incident where Peter hacked off an ear, and Jesus put it back.
Don't you consider this a healed amputation?
Just Askin'
Anonymous said...
I was healed of asthma at age 7. And I had it bad. Haven't had it since. A WCG minister annoited me."
Poor God. Can heal asthma and incurable brain cancer but can't heal a single amputee. His ways are mysterious indeed.
Paul Ray
----------
You cynically bring up an valid and interesting question:
Does prayer have anything to do with God?
Or is it an effect of concerned human beings (Spirit in "carbon based wetsuits") expressing their intent?
I don't know the answer...but I do know, after an anointing prayer, I never had it again. In the absence of competing evidence, I tend to attribute it to God. But I could be wrong. And I'll be the first admit my concept of God is not the WCG concept. The "Sky God" concept has spawned a good many atheists.
It could be the intent of a kind human being at work. And that would explain the wide variety of results.
Healing is a gift given to certain humans. I think it was arrogance of the WCG to teach that all ministers (and for that matter - ONLY ministers) could do it.
Maybe, we blame God for too much?
Maybe he doesn't answer prayer?
Maybe we do. We are the eyes and hands of God, we are how things get done on this planet.
"They are targetting these people, and attempting to remedy the situation."
Getcher semi-automatic KJVs here people! Beat those bibles at them godless pagans as loud as you can! If they tell you they have their own gods don't pay them no nevermind! Their gods are eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeevil!!!
/sarcasm
"We are the eyes and hands of God, we are how things get done on this planet."
Now, this, I like. Much better than Sky Buddy.
Aggie
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