tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post6760737928898447045..comments2023-11-05T20:19:44.812+13:00Comments on Ambassador Watch: Give generouslyGavinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03060097218905523899noreply@blogger.comBlogger39125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-38959689443284392672007-07-12T17:46:00.000+12:002007-07-12T17:46:00.000+12:00At least Monte can draw! That alone is worth a sa...At least Monte can draw! That alone is worth a salary...but I really wish he'd take that great talent and put it to work in a real job, like Drawing Cartoons! Hey, its honorable work!<BR/><BR/>Greg's call to fame is arranging bad marriages among AC Seniors and intimidating underclassmen.<BR/>Like that is worth $160K? AMERICAN KABUKIhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11064036099785125749noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-28524370862829142852007-07-10T18:38:00.000+12:002007-07-10T18:38:00.000+12:00Douglas,Off subject.....I thought this idea was ex...Douglas,<BR/><BR/>Off subject.....<BR/>I thought this idea was excellent!<BR/>http://www.theonion.com/<BR/>content/video/report_many_u_s_parentsKScribehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07034049680872790004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-34887059338314643842007-07-10T12:57:00.000+12:002007-07-10T12:57:00.000+12:00Gavin,God does indeed love a cheerful giver.So doe...Gavin,<BR/><BR/>God does indeed love a cheerful giver.<BR/><BR/>So does Spanky,Dave Albrecht,Gerry Flurry.<BR/><BR/>Here in good old NZ on one occasion,then Senior Pastor,now Bishop Brian Tamaki of Destiny Church was being interviewed on TV One's "Good Morning" programme hosted by Mary Lambie.<BR/><BR/>She commented about his swish sartorial getup and questioned how a clergyman could afford such expensive threads.<BR/><BR/>Brian replied," The Lord has Blessed Me".<BR/><BR/>Hallelujah,brother,I wonder how many people went in need<BR/><BR/>Truly,it is a world-wide phenomenon.<BR/><BR/>Bless 'em all.<BR/><BR/>SeamusAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-6473424502417108072007-07-10T07:33:00.000+12:002007-07-10T07:33:00.000+12:00"I remember sitting and hearing Joe Tkach Sr. yell..."I remember sitting and hearing Joe Tkach Sr. yelling in a sermon if he was wrong, "may God strike me dead." "<BR/><BR/>A case of being careful what you ask forAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-54273517423825891542007-07-09T12:23:00.000+12:002007-07-09T12:23:00.000+12:00Dennis..formerly known as Mr. Diehlwell... ok. My...Dennis..formerly known as Mr. Diehl<BR/><BR/>well... ok. My counselor says it's good therapy. This is the same guy who noted when I first met him..."hmmmmm, you got got fired by God..this will be interesting.." :) (For which I'm eternally grateful by the way.)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-62800195262192866512007-07-09T12:04:00.000+12:002007-07-09T12:04:00.000+12:00Dennis, NEVER shut up!;-)Dennis, NEVER shut up!<BR/><BR/>;-)Gavinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03060097218905523899noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-49814147765033393062007-07-09T10:04:00.000+12:002007-07-09T10:04:00.000+12:00No, no. Excellent post, and...Joe Tkach Sr. yellin...No, no. Excellent post, and...<BR/><BR/><I>Joe Tkach Sr. yelling in a sermon if he was wrong, "may God strike me dead."</I><BR/><BR/>It should be pointed out that Senior did die shy of seven years and from painful [brain?] cancer. It was lies right up to the end.<BR/><BR/>Yes, some of us saw the infamous tape where Tkach said, "Sometimes I lie...".<BR/><BR/>No empathy. No conscience. Only games.<BR/><BR/>Dennis your post was right on the mark. Well said.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-49100679666076422942007-07-09T09:10:00.000+12:002007-07-09T09:10:00.000+12:00Formerly Known as Mr. Diehl"One group blathering h...Formerly Known as Mr. Diehl<BR/><BR/>"One group blathering hypocrites for believing something different from what they taught and the other group blathering idiots for not understanding it."<BR/><BR/>It was a freaking mess. Every minister I knew was in personal turmoil over what was happening, much less why. The idea that the Tkaches could move to change in months, what a real church would never change or would change in generations, it seemed, was spiritual thuggary at it's worst.<BR/><BR/>I remember sitting and hearing Joe Tkach Sr. yelling in a sermon if he was wrong, "may God strike me dead." Very dramatic. I guess we were all supposed to think how brave and how right he must be to say that. Normally I would not make a connection and chalk it up to coincidence, but I remember thinking to myself, "I wouldn't have said that..." <BR/><BR/>It was very confusing and I'd at least like to say from experience, that when one would ask "Are we changing to Sunday?" are we doing away with clean and unclean, are we going to give up holydays and keep christmas? 100 % of the time they said "oh no," and 100% of it was lies to the faces of men who had no clue what was true anymore or not. I sat in meetings that in hindsite were pure lies. I kept thinking the foolishness would stop. <BR/><BR/>I will go to my grave saying that the Tkaches should have quit if they were that convinced it was all wrong. There were PLENTY of places to park their sorry asses in a church that would not care who they were. Maybe that was the problem. It is not a matter of who was right or wrong. WCG is more wrong now than it ever was. Instead of forcing everyone to see it one way, they had an obligation to simply leave and let those of OLD WCG persuasion take it from there without them. Some of my friends would still be alive if they had not forced such reckless foolishness on the deeply held spirituality, no matter how accurate or not, on the majority.<BR/><BR/>A real board would have put the Tkaches out to pasture and on the street, instead of yielding to the artificial bullying that no doubt went on. They used the "Mr. Armstrong appointed me.." for as long as it served them in securing themselves a place, a pension and something to keep them busy until they die. <BR/><BR/>The fact that Joe Tkach Jr. is STILL there is testimony of the good ol boy network that frankly was born out of the Imperial Schools buddy system. <BR/><BR/>There are hundreds of former ministers...where are they? Where are the MILLIONS of dollars realized by Tkach, Schnippert, and Co? In the bank is not good enough. They raped the church and because we did not cry out loud enough, we must have given the impression we enjoyed it so got stoned and they got rich...in Jesus.<BR/><BR/>When Ron Kelly told me there can be no retirement because of Jesus great miracle in WCG, I asked him to his face why Jesus could not have backed up one miracle and insired the right doctrine and belief in the first place and save us all the heartache. Does Jesus like to play games and fool us first time around?...no answer.<BR/><BR/>I guess that is a real miracle after all. <BR/><BR/>PS I'll regret submitting this but I have a sore spot over "you ministers," "real education" "payback time" "hypocrites" and all the other easy to dump labels on "the ministers." WCG ministers AND MEMBERS of old had a better grasp of many things, if you take the text literally and in the Jewish origins of Christianity context than any of these Bob Jones clones up the street. <BR/><BR/>The theological problem WCG could never resolve nor can fundamentalists today is that the Early Church under James and Paul were NOT friends. They did not agree with each other and all the confusion of law and grace stems from trying make a silk purse for James out of Paul's sows ears. It's why one can never quite nail down if Paul is for the law or against it. The answer is "yes." It's why every side of every issue can claim Paul as their champion. Just remember a man who can be "all thing to all men," has no soul or center. He's a salesman. <BR/><BR/>Dennis shut up...:)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-85962639201505508402007-07-09T08:32:00.000+12:002007-07-09T08:32:00.000+12:00Ironically, it is the ones who left or were dismis...Ironically, it is the ones who left or were dismissed who came away with the most honor left over.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-44490811742912759432007-07-09T07:53:00.000+12:002007-07-09T07:53:00.000+12:00formerly known as DennisPS but it's all good 'cau...formerly known as Dennis<BR/><BR/>PS but it's all good 'cause I'm paying getting my just reward for being such a bastard pastard :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-23137730472838310802007-07-09T07:51:00.000+12:002007-07-09T07:51:00.000+12:00gotta close up shop here at hospital. Have answere...gotta close up shop here at hospital. Have answered as many calls and questions as I can stand today! :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-38494862733307144782007-07-09T07:50:00.001+12:002007-07-09T07:50:00.001+12:00formerly known as DennisI know it's so. I grew up ...formerly known as Dennis<BR/><BR/>I know it's so. I grew up Presbyterian long before I ever heard of WCG. Now at the hospital where I work, I have pastor "friends" who know my background and they have excellent credentials along with massive doubts about how to handle what they really feel about the errancy and historicity issues of the Bible. They are good men, just as MOST of my WCG minister friends were. Very sincere, hard working and not in it for the money one bit. The money was going to the ranked at the top above WCG "pastor rank" level it seems. I was ordained an LE six mos out of college, a Preaching Elder one year out of college and never again. I wasn't in the budget..ha. I had to ask Joe Tkach for a bit of help to go on the dig I won from Biblical Archaeology Magazine in 96 to dig at Megiddo for three weeks. I didn't ahve the money for the extras. He gave it to me from AICF I believe. BAR paid for everything. It was the greatest trip of my life for a ten minute essay and I sat for three weeks with Israel Finkelstein as he explain the non bible history of his cultic people in search of a grand illusion, mostly in the form of David and Solomon for which he could find precious little archaelogical history. Baruch Halpern, also at the dig, swooshed down a few too many and told me the OT was concoted to give an insignificant bunch of people an amazing history that never happened in space and time. <BR/><BR/>After than, I read Rescuing the Bible From Fundamentalism, and the rest is history, thank my lucky goddess...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-31123262556922441202007-07-09T07:50:00.000+12:002007-07-09T07:50:00.000+12:00So he gave the expected spiel on Sundays to the co...<I>So he gave the expected spiel on Sundays to the congregation, but frankly disagreed with a good bit of what he said!</I><BR/><BR/>As the doctrine of the Trinity gained ascendancy in the WCG after Herbert Armstrong's death, it appears that many ministers preached what they disagreed with on Saturday. The rest who did not understand at all what they were preaching and didn't have a clue continued with the WCG, even to this day.<BR/><BR/>One group blathering hypocrites for believing something different from what they taught and the other group blathering idiots for not understanding it.<BR/><BR/>And there was the other group that left or was dismissed.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-8649523899628407542007-07-09T07:11:00.000+12:002007-07-09T07:11:00.000+12:00Former Dennis, that is exactly what was told to me...Former Dennis, that is exactly what was told to me some years ago by a fellow student in a Religious Studies class. He had been quite a devout Presbyterian, and then his church got a new assistant pastor, being near to my fellow student's age. Since the student (who was in his thirties at the time) was going for a B.A. in Religious Studies, the asst. pastor "opened up" about a lot of things, and told him that what he learned and discovered in seminary very often was in sharp contrast to what Presbyterians were supposed to hear from the pulpit. So he gave the expected spiel on Sundays to the congregation, but frankly disagreed with a good bit of what he said!camfinchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15687305972492937862noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-5070631564683183142007-07-09T06:40:00.000+12:002007-07-09T06:40:00.000+12:00...formerly known as DennisHad I attended Westmini......formerly known as Dennis<BR/><BR/>Had I attended Westminister Theological Seminary or Calvin College associated with my upbringing, instead of treaking off to WCG, which seemed right from a distance, I probably would have realized a lot sooner that the Bible is not generally quite as any local congregation imagines, and either gone on to teach new wannabe's more of the truth of the matter, or pastored selectively hoping certain topics did not come up. <BR/><BR/>My very well theologically educated friends, always have, "but I'll loose my job if I tell them what I really know and have come to believe..." in their bag of coping skills.<BR/><BR/>A highly educated fundamentalist is ignorant in a quality way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-52861593069786924492007-07-09T06:37:00.000+12:002007-07-09T06:37:00.000+12:00The massive transfers to PTM in previous years app...The massive transfers to PTM in previous years appear to be for the purpose of SBS (Siphoning by Salaries)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-86487259486522832472007-07-09T05:53:00.000+12:002007-07-09T05:53:00.000+12:00WCG & PTM:Live the fantasy.WCG & PTM:<BR/><BR/>Live the fantasy.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-49760375608030997252007-07-09T04:56:00.000+12:002007-07-09T04:56:00.000+12:00I know what my pastor is paid because I'm on the s...I know what my pastor is paid because I'm on the session (Which approves these sorts of things). $47k plus $3k in an annuity. He also gets $0.48 per mile reimbursement for gas / wear & tear. Fringe benefits: Health insurance, and the manse to live in on church grounds.<BR/><BR/>That's it...and he does have real degrees from a real university and a seminary.<BR/><BR/>$47k is not very much money in NJ and he works his butt off for every penny of it too.<BR/><BR/>He also never started off a pastor's report at a session meeting with: "...and there I was 8 miles over the Pacific ocean in my G3."<BR/><BR/>Put that in your pipe and smoke it, Flurry.<BR/><BR/>I think that many WCG ministers found out real quick after things fell apart, just what is was like to be poor and nothing in the bank. Many deserved such a reckoning, some didn't.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-54466147448664410542007-07-09T04:48:00.000+12:002007-07-09T04:48:00.000+12:00Internet COG Hymn Number One and Two"Blessed and H...Internet COG Hymn Number One and Two<BR/><BR/>"Blessed and Happy is the Scam<BR/>That doth never go away<BR/>Flipping 'or to Internet<BR/>Blesses us to Prey<BR/><BR/>All We does, prospers well<BR/>But the Brethren are not sooo<BR/>They are sheep before the snips<BR/>Shorn from head to toe<BR/><BR/>We shall be a tree that grows<BR/>Planted on the Internet<BR/>If you think you've had enough<BR/>Weee just aren't done yet.<BR/><BR/>All we does, prospers well<BR/>And we will until we die<BR/>Keep your bucks a flowin here<BR/>Jesus in three to five......<BR/><BR/>aaaaaaaaaaaaaa.ahhhh ahhhhhhh meeeennnnnn.................<BR/><BR/>or how 'bout<BR/><BR/>Praise me the Lordo<BR/>Praise me the Lordo<BR/>Praise in Ohio and Praise in the Heights.<BR/>Praise Me ye Brethren<BR/>Praise me ye Deacons <BR/>And praise me no matter how badly I frights.<BR/><BR/>Praise me the Lordo<BR/>Praise me the Lordo<BR/>Praise me in Charlotte above all the rest.<BR/>They do a small work, we dews a big one<BR/>Oh Praise me presiding 'or all I surveeeey<BR/><BR/>Praise me Generalissimo<BR/>Praise me Generalissimo<BR/>Praise for my cunning and reckless delight<BR/>Praise me all pastors<BR/>Praise me all splinters<BR/>Without me you'd not have a work overnight!<BR/><BR/>Arranged by M. T. HallAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-73653196402199058062007-07-09T04:03:00.000+12:002007-07-09T04:03:00.000+12:00Here at e-inchurchchance we keep overhead low by e...Here at e-inchurchchance we keep overhead low by eliminating high maintenance offices and personnel and providing our services entirely over the Internet.<BR/><BR/>If you want services, come to us because we can insure that no CoG can beat our rates.<BR/><BR/>So forget the other guys: e-inchurchchance is the best services money can buy with your tithes and offerings at a low low price.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-62184630991777831082007-07-08T23:12:00.000+12:002007-07-08T23:12:00.000+12:00Has anyone fotografed Meredith's new east coast ma...Has anyone fotografed Meredith's new east coast mansion ? It must be spectacular. I know you couldn't get near Garner Ted's Tyler mansion because he wisely located in a gated community to keep the riff-raff away.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-83277613769550188972007-07-08T11:11:00.000+12:002007-07-08T11:11:00.000+12:00Skip Church...Save 10-30%Skip Church...Save 10-30%Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-45072467588541659522007-07-08T11:00:00.000+12:002007-07-08T11:00:00.000+12:00WCG congregations could immediately save up to 15%...<I>WCG congregations could immediately save up to 15% or more by eliminating the payments to toady, bloated, secretive, and unresponsive HQ by keeping it for themselves...</I><BR/><BR/>Here at Progressive Church of God, we allow prospective members to compare our rates with other churches with online instant quotes. It makes a big difference if you tithe on net or gross and how often you take the annual offerings. Potential members will be pleased that we only ask for three offerings a year instead of the traditional seven and we give liberal allowances for deductions off the net 10% owed to God.<BR/><BR/>If you can find a cheaper church than Progressive, we'll help you contact our competition for a ministerial visit to screen you for membership.Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-23286935464415457982007-07-08T10:28:00.000+12:002007-07-08T10:28:00.000+12:00"Save 15%? That sounds familiar... Is this process..."Save 15%? That sounds familiar... Is this process so easy a caveman could use it?"<BR/><BR/>WCG congregations could immediately <B>save up to 15% or more</B> by eliminating the payments to toady, bloated, secretive, and unresponsive HQ by keeping it for themselves...<BR/><BR/>Caveat EmptorStanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15189373275825472416noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28426681.post-9370372654717110672007-07-08T10:11:00.000+12:002007-07-08T10:11:00.000+12:00With the high cost of supporting religion, it migh...With the high cost of supporting religion, it might be time to consider <A HREF="http://www.theonion.com/content/node/40517" REL="nofollow">Home Churching as <BR/>described in <I>The Onion</I></A>:<BR/><BR/>Home-churchers create their own services, emphasizing close readings of Old Testament books led by a parent, and sermons that often exceed two hours. Proponents of home-churching argue that, when handed down by family members, biblical teachings take on a more direct, personal meaning. Additionally, they say home-churching reinforces familial bonds.<BR/><BR/>"My kids don't have to understand everything in the Bible—I don't claim to," Beebe said. "But it ain't my place to question God's will. As long as my Caleb grows up understanding pestilence, sin, massacres, and to eternally fear the wrath of our Lord—and not this warm and fuzzy 'universal brotherhood' crap—then I've done right by Jesus."<BR/><BR/>Critics of the home-churching movement argue that its practitioners deprive children of a well-rounded religious education. <BR/><BR/>"An untrained theologian is not equipped to address the thornier questions of morality," said Rev. Lawrence Case of Grace Methodist Church in Homestead, FL. "Home-churchers often make their own interpretations of complicated biblical instruction such as 'knowing' daughters, or whether eating a rock-badger is as sinful as eating a regular one."Douglas Beckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05639275357879979640noreply@blogger.com